Health Insurance: We don't need no stinkin' health insurance
Saturday, February 5th, 2011 07:28 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
rolanniI preface this by saying that I have health insurance. I have it at the price of stories that will never be written and by working a day-job with which I share, at best, an uneasy truce. The health insurance recently saved Steve's life. Without it, we could not, we could never have afforded the roughly $110,000 billed to date for his heart-related condition. The more than $22,000 associated with his week-long hospitalization for pneumonia in October of last year would have already wiped us out.
Edited to add: The state of Maine puts out a nice, comprehensive consumer guide to individual health care available to Maine citizens.
Originally posted by![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
ladyqkat at Dear GOP - the collective you are an Idiot
Edited to add: The state of Maine puts out a nice, comprehensive consumer guide to individual health care available to Maine citizens.
Originally posted by
ladyqkat at Dear GOP - the collective you are an IdiotContent originally seen in this post by ramblin_phyl and in this post by suricattus
There is a move afoot in the nation -driven by the GOP - to repeal the new health care laws, to protect corporate interests, to defend against fear-mongering (and stupid) cries of "socialism!", and to ensure that people are forced to choose between keeping a roof over their heads or getting necessary health care.
This movement is killing people.
Think I'm overstating the fact?
Ask the friends and family of writer/reviewer Melissa Mia Hall, who died of a heart attack last week because she was so terrified of medical bills, she didn't go see a doctor who could have saved her life.
From another writer friend: One person. Not the only one. That could have been me. Yeah, I have access to insurance -- I live in New York City, which is freelancer-friendly, and have access to freelancer advocacy groups. Through them, I can pay over $400/month ($5,760/year) as a single, healthy woman, so that if I go to the hospital I'm not driven to bankruptcy. But a doctor's appointment - a routine physical - can still cost me several hundred dollars each visit. So unless something's terribly wrong? I won't go.
My husband worked for the government for 30 years. We have government employee (retired) insurance. It is the only thing of value he took away from that job. His pension is pitiful. He still works part time. My writing income has diminished drastically. Our combined income is now less than what it was before T retired fifteen years ago. Inflation has diminished it further. In the last 30 days I have racked up over $8000 in medical bills for tests and the beginning of treatment. Our co-pay is 20% after the deductible. And there is more to come. Our savings are already gone. I have the gold standard of insurance and I still can't pay all the medical bills.
Another friend lost her insurance when her husband lost his job. She couldn't afford medication and ended up bed ridden for three months at the end of over a year of no job and therefore no insurance until he found work again.
It's our responsibility. All of us, together. As a nation.
EtA: Nobody is trying to put insurance companies out of business. They will always be able to offer a better plan for a premium. We simply want to ensure that every citizen - from infant to senior citizen - doesn't have to choose between medical care, and keeping a roof over their heads, or having enough to eat.
We're trying to get this to go viral. Pass it along.
ramblin_phyl and in this post by suricattus There is a move afoot in the nation -driven by the GOP - to repeal the new health care laws, to protect corporate interests, to defend against fear-mongering (and stupid) cries of "socialism!", and to ensure that people are forced to choose between keeping a roof over their heads or getting necessary health care.
This movement is killing people.
Think I'm overstating the fact?
Ask the friends and family of writer/reviewer Melissa Mia Hall, who died of a heart attack last week because she was so terrified of medical bills, she didn't go see a doctor who could have saved her life.
From another writer friend: One person. Not the only one. That could have been me. Yeah, I have access to insurance -- I live in New York City, which is freelancer-friendly, and have access to freelancer advocacy groups. Through them, I can pay over $400/month ($5,760/year) as a single, healthy woman, so that if I go to the hospital I'm not driven to bankruptcy. But a doctor's appointment - a routine physical - can still cost me several hundred dollars each visit. So unless something's terribly wrong? I won't go.
My husband worked for the government for 30 years. We have government employee (retired) insurance. It is the only thing of value he took away from that job. His pension is pitiful. He still works part time. My writing income has diminished drastically. Our combined income is now less than what it was before T retired fifteen years ago. Inflation has diminished it further. In the last 30 days I have racked up over $8000 in medical bills for tests and the beginning of treatment. Our co-pay is 20% after the deductible. And there is more to come. Our savings are already gone. I have the gold standard of insurance and I still can't pay all the medical bills.
Another friend lost her insurance when her husband lost his job. She couldn't afford medication and ended up bed ridden for three months at the end of over a year of no job and therefore no insurance until he found work again.
It's our responsibility. All of us, together. As a nation.
EtA: Nobody is trying to put insurance companies out of business. They will always be able to offer a better plan for a premium. We simply want to ensure that every citizen - from infant to senior citizen - doesn't have to choose between medical care, and keeping a roof over their heads, or having enough to eat.
We're trying to get this to go viral. Pass it along.
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no subject
Date: 2011-02-06 12:34 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-02-06 12:39 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-02-06 12:49 am (UTC)insurance/spit
Date: 2011-02-06 01:50 am (UTC)I HATE Insurance companies. I use that word with absolute conviction.
And what you had to pay for Steve is obscene. We have entered Russian serfdom, and neither side has Any interest in cutting us loose from it.
I would so much rather have more and wonderful stories from you, than you slaving at a truly stupid job, just so you can both survive.
Bless you both, and may you be well, and as happy as can be.
Nanette
no subject
Date: 2011-02-06 02:33 am (UTC)Health Insurance
Date: 2011-02-06 02:52 am (UTC)Re: Health Insurance
Date: 2011-02-06 03:00 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-02-06 03:42 am (UTC)Without it, we would probably be in debt for the rest of our lives for our premature son's 73-day NICU stay at birth, plus the other hospital visits he needed later. Ordinary GP visits for under 5's are free, to insure parents take their children to the doctor when they need it, not when they can afford it.
My brother and SIL would be in the same position after my SIL was in a serious car accident last year and spend 3 months in hospital, not to mention a rescue helicopter flight and ICU care, plus all the follow up care and surgeries over the last 18 months.
I simply do not understand this opposition to basic heatlh care for our fellow human beings. It doesn't make sense to me.
no subject
Date: 2011-02-06 03:45 am (UTC)health care
Date: 2011-02-06 03:51 am (UTC)Sidney
Oops
Date: 2011-02-06 03:55 am (UTC)Sidney
That darned socialism
Date: 2011-02-06 05:28 am (UTC)Idiots. In a sane country, education and public health are infrastructure investments. In America, education is held hostage by the local tax base, and health isn't public.
Health Care
Date: 2011-02-06 06:58 am (UTC)Is there any possibility of getting Steve on Social Security disability? Thats Soc Sec SSI. I have a friend that went on that program at the age of about 60. It has Medicare insurance attached. Or medicaid? I know the states are cutting back on this. Maine unfortunately is one of the states with the largest debt. In AZ the governor has already cut health care coverage for transplants. People have already died because of that.
Our very high health care costs are as a result of having our health care still squarely in the hands of the insurance companies. I hope that someday we will be able to go on a single payer system...that is, Medicare for all. Such a system would have much lower costs. I know that Canada and Britain's health care system which is single payer one are struggling due to the economy but I think that anything would be better than what we have now. As Michael Moore says these insurance companies should not be allowed to make a profit off the illnesses and misery of our citizens. It's actually unethical and immoral to do so.
C.
Taxes
Date: 2011-02-06 07:11 am (UTC)C.
A hissing and a scandal
Date: 2011-02-06 01:10 pm (UTC)Re-thug-licans who want to repeal Obama care are protecting their families and themselves with their government health care plans. What hypocrites!
Anne in Virginia
no subject
Date: 2011-02-06 06:41 pm (UTC)I have insurance through my job, but the insurance company is so good at avoiding claims that I've been denied coverage for most everything.
health insurance
Date: 2011-02-06 08:15 pm (UTC)But Obamacare ain't the answer. The premiums for health coverage are not going to go down under te government plan. People who can't afford health insurance now are still going to be unable to afford the premiums after being forced by the government to buy it.
I'm no expert, but if the government would allow us to buy bare bones health coverage (catastrophic only, or Health Savings Accounts, or like me being single, not needing to by insurance for kids or pregnancy, or mental illness care if I don't want to) basic health care without the mandates, more people would be able to afford health insurance.
I have catastrophic care for Cheetah Cat. Doesn't cover office visits, or annual shots, or wellness care. But kicks in for serious care and only costs me about $250 a year.
We should have the same flexibility in choosing our people health coverage.
I know this won't be popular...
Date: 2011-02-06 11:34 pm (UTC)There has to be a better plan than this. I depise ultimatums - such as the Obamacare vs. the current lousy system rhetoric that's going on now - because they stifle meaningful and productive dialogue and prevent real solutions from being found.
I extend my condolences to the family and friends of Melissa Mia Hall. Her life should not have ended this way, and she should not have had to face the fear of losing her home over tending her health.
One's home should always be safe from medical collections.
Re: I know this won't be popular...
Date: 2011-02-07 12:22 am (UTC)We're at the point now where people are dying in order that the stockholders of insurance companies can collect their "profits." That's blood money, that's wrong, and nobody is controlling them.
If this were a cheesy sci-fi novel, we could try the Insurance Company Corporate Persons for murder.
So. Better an imperfect new system than a continuation of and old system that profits a few at the expense of the suffering of many. Once we have the new, imperfect system, we can fix it, if enough people are outraged. And it sounds like the only thing either side can agree on is being outraged*.
_____
*Some outrage to get us started:
A fifty-nine percent across the board INCREASE in insurance premiums in California? Really? FIFTY-NINE percent? In this economy? And the reason? Oh, says the insurance companies, so many healthy people are dropping out of the plans [me: because they can't in this economy afford to have health insurance and are gambling they won't get sick], everyone who is left is sick and we can't afford that.
In Maine, if you clicked the link in my post, I can pay over $20,000 a year in premiums for myself and my husband, and that's before we start talking about age and pre-existing conditions. Twenty thousand dollars is every bit of money I make at the day-job in a year. I want to pay for my own health insurance and be free to seek my own fortune. Years -- and I'm talking five, six years -- ago, I was able to do that. Now? Twenty grand off the top for health care, and then I can start worrying about food and the mortgage? Who makes this kind of money? Not mid-list scifi writers. Or college secretaries, either.
Re: health insurance
Date: 2011-02-07 12:25 am (UTC)The premiums for health coverage are not going to go down under te government plan.
Right. Because the other part of the plan is to Really Regulate the for-profit health insurance companies. Which ain't gonna happen.
Re: health insurance
Date: 2011-02-07 01:31 am (UTC)Look at the mess the Gov't has made of our educational system.
(but that's another story), do you really want the bureaucrats in charge of our healtcare?
Healthcare in PA
Date: 2011-02-07 01:08 pm (UTC)I did manage to pick up individual health insurance Blue Cross / Blue Shield for about $180 / month with a $3,000 deductible. This was a much better deal than trying to maintain my previous coverage under COBRA.
On the positive side, this means that I have something to hopefully fall back on in case of dire emergency - assuming that I would still have the deductible stashed away if and when something happens.
The negative to this is that my deductible is high just so I can afford premiums and because I don't want to spend money out of pocket, I'm not likely to go to the doctors unless I'm absolutely desperate. Also my policy does not include dental or eye, so all of those costs would have to be completely covered by me if I were to have a problem.
Just as an aside, you may not be aware but hospitals and medical providers charge people who don't have health insurance higher rates than they charge the insurance companies.
If you have health insurance and you get an MRI and it is covered, the health insurance is charged maybe something like $1,000. If you are an individual without coverage, the hospital may charge you $2,000 for the same service.
We had to pay down a $2,000 bill when my s.o.'s insurance wouldn't cover an MRI. Most hospitals or medical providers will put you on a monthly payment plan if you call them and tell them that you are willing to meet your financial obligation, but that you just can't afford to make a lump sum payment. This is something to keep in mind if you have mounting medical bills because not paying them at all does damage your credit rating.
Pet Insurance
Date: 2011-02-07 01:16 pm (UTC)$1,500 for the 17 year old to have emergency dental surgery because her few remaining teeth that hadn't been surgically removed were infected again and $500 for the 13 year old to have a growth removed, that thankfully turned out to be benign.
Ironic that I spend more on the cats than I spend on me. Come to think of it, they actually get regular checkups, too...
Re: I know this won't be popular...
Date: 2011-02-07 02:03 pm (UTC)The current state of healthcare is dreadful, but so is the current state of education, infrastructure, Social Security, the national parks, etc. When the federal government shows some competence in fixing those, then I'll believe it can fix healthcare.
The whole plan might be more believable if it included funding and incentives for more doctors and facilities. As it is, hospitals and clinics are crowded and staff is overworked, and not enough people can afford to complete med school. Don't forget that the VA clinics are about to be (more) flooded - we have lots of new veterans coming home from the wars, who are covered by the government if they can just get an appointment. My dad can already tell you that won't be easy.
I know that lots of people are desperate for medical care - my parents' only income was from a tiny family business, and we hovered at the poverty line for years (the old poverty line, the less-than-teachers-make one)and we went without insurance for long stretches. If one of us had had so much as bad allergies, we might have been sunk. I'm upset about my parents' current lack of care - but it's because even though they should be covered by Medicare and the VA, there is no room.
Obamacare, to me, looks like it's going to put the entire country in the same fix. We already know there's unmet demand for healthcare - how is that solved by compulsory insurance? Where's the supply? What doctor is not insanely busy already?
I'm not so much outraged as I am (very) disinclined to believe the promises :) If you want outrage, we'd have to discuss sex trafficking or abused children.
Thank you for not letting the discussion turn into a melee - I'm glad that we can disagree civilly :)
Re: health insurance
Date: 2011-02-07 02:19 pm (UTC)Re: I know this won't be popular...
Date: 2011-02-08 01:56 am (UTC)As I understand things, the everybody has to buy insurance idea serves two purposes. First, it gets insurance companies to buy in on the rest of the mandates as they can pay for it by charging everybody instead. Second and most important, in my mind, if everybody has insurance, we can start doing cheaper preventative care and interventions before any given condition gets intolerable enough that the patient will see a doctor, regardless of cost. That early early intervention should reduce the demand and allocate supply to where it will do the most good. It won't happen quickly, but it can happen.
Some of the problems with the health care system can be addressed by changing the insurance rules for doctor - they are more likely to go where it is less financially risky to practice (dermatology) than where the need might be (primary care physicians).
As for the VA - it should come as no surprise that vets come back from wars needing health care. The number of vets is not unknown. In my humble opinion, it should have been included as a cost to the current war funding when the wars were started - but those wars were presented off budget.
As for the government being incompetent to fix the health care system - I think its the only place to change the system. When everyone wants a deal (ie the highest possible service paid for by somebody else), doctors make spending decisions (tests, prescriptions, courses of treatment, etc) spending money controlled by insurance companies on behalf of patients who are not generally conscious of the detailed costs, there are plenty of places where responsibility and feedback are aligned with outcomes. I think you have to change the rules to get the relationships to responsibility to change and the only entity that can radically change the rules is the federal government.
To get effective reform, one would have to change the campaign financing laws so that the various regulation writers are more immune to the power and sway of lobbyists and their money.
Its all an interrelated mess. We're doomed, as always. "Get or make your own fortune" is the only sure way to have adequate access to health care.
Re: I know this won't be popular...
Date: 2011-02-08 06:09 pm (UTC)To clarify my opinion on the government's competence - I have very little faith in their ability to target the cause of the problem, because their track record on things they are already in charge of is so abysmal. Now, if they demonstate competence with those, that might be different. I know, the only way to get reform is through the government, but the government needs reform, which will be when the people come together and find enough common ground to begin the process.
The general uproar about the Evil Rich Insurance Companies seems simplistic. I believe the main problem is that the people in charge of a given system, whether it be the government or a private enterprise, tend to have two basic goals in mind: First, to further their own agenda. Second, to do as little actual work as possible.
So I think that Obama and co. saw the need for healthcare reform, saw the general attitudes toward big insurance companies, and saw an opportunity to make a big change to further their own agendas.
It could very well be that big insurance companies are evil and their profits are essentially blood money.
But what is being forgotten in our haste to fix the system? I just don't like this dash to embrace Obamacare and its vast promises - something doesn't feel right. It didn't go through due process, it's loaded with special deals for various states, it funds highly controversial practices, and in order to work, the entire nation has to buy in. I find it extraordinarily off-putting. The only thing I can think of that it resembles is a pyramid scheme.
Re: I know this won't be popular...
Date: 2011-02-10 04:16 am (UTC)I think the entire nation has to buy in because it affects everyone directly or indirectly. It isn't as if most of the 20 year olds won't need eldercare in a few decades.
I'm not generally in favor of breaking systems as a means of initiating repair. The current system is broken on many counts. The discussion is about how to fix it and the transition will be painful.
One could argue that health care is a security issue not just for the military (they need able recruits and to be able to care for returning vets) but for the economy - if we put so much GDP to such poor use, we are at an economic disadvantage due to the implied national tax of ineffective health care.
That aside, my view is that this was a once every few decades opportunity to begin addressing the problem. No, they couldn't begin to get it anywhere near right, much less ideal initially. They did manage to get the conversation started on a realistic (ie financial, outcomes and responsibility ) level.
Politics is an unsavory art at best. I am hoping that the most painful parts of the compromises necessary to get enough votes will be worked out and adjusted at the same time some unintended consequences are brought to light. It may be a forlorn hope. I applaud them for doing something, with some intention of mid-course correction, now. The impact of not taking action would be to make the current problems worse (we may disagree on this point). At least this is not an incremental solution which only postpones decisions.
Ideally, anyone putting forth new changes will have to justify why they are better. In doing so, they will reveal their biases of who benefits from "better" and who pays for it.
Separating political necessity from the original idealized solution is difficult for those of us sitting on the sidelines.