Trust in God, but tie your camel

[rolanni]

So the short story's done in first draft, clocking in at 7,300 words.  It still needs a title (hmmmm...Camel?) and a thorough going-over, but for today it, and I, rest.  By which I mean, "signing several hundred blank pages."  And doing the dishes.  Because yesterday was about writing 5,000+ words, and the dishes suffered for it.

In other news, the Deluxe Scrabble edition which is our Yule present to each other arrived on Friday, and has been sitting on the Mencken Table making with the come-hithers.  We have, so far, Been Strong.

Also!  The Christmas catalogs have begun to arrive.  I love Christmas catalogs, they're so full of. . .stuff.  Ridiculous, useful, in some cases sublime stuff.  Things I never knew existed.  Truly, Christmas is a season of joy.

I'm still working my way, page-by-page when time allows, through Maphead, which is continuing to amuse.  I've just finished a chapter dealing with (among other things, like the National Geographic Geography Bee, and people who turn maps upside down so they're pointing in the direction of travel) people who make up their own geographies.

The 1942 smash hit, Islandia, was the lifework of Austin Wright, who began imagining his world when he was a boy, and continued to work on building its culture, language, geography, and customs throughout his life, until his untimely demise.  (Read all about it here).  The papers from which Mr. Wright's widow and daughter extracted the novel ran to manymany hundreds of pages.

Also discussed, of course, is Tolkien, and Brandon Sanderson, who is quoted as saying something like it's the maps that allow people to immerse themselves in fantasy novels.  A sentiment with which -- speaking as someone who skips over, and is frequently annoyed by, the maps -- I am not in agreement.  Having a map of Mirkwood Forest doesn't make me "believe in" Mirkwood Forest; I believe in Mirkwood Forest because it's real.  Sheesh.

That aside, and speaking as someone who, at an early age, started in to build what became the Liaden Universe®, I'm amused by the author's assumption that people who tend toward that particular imaginative exercise are inevitably mapheads and/or that maps will definitely be part of the process of defining the world.

I am. . .whatever the opposite of a maphead is.  Unless I've walked an area, a map of it makes no sense to me.  If I have walked an area, then I can "see" the houses and the landmarks on its map. I have a map of Old Orchard Beach hanging on my wall.  It serves the same function, for me, as knots on a memory string, to remind me of locations I already intimately know.

It amazes me that Steve (who is a maphead) can look at a map of foreign climes and immediately know how to get from Point A to Point B.  How's he do that?

I guess I'm saying that there won't be any maps of the Liaden Universe® coming anytime soon.

But -- here's a question for all you voracious readers out there -- do maps lend weight or reality to your fiction-reading experience?  What (else) makes a world "real" to you?

Discuss.

. . .and I'm off to do the dishes.

Comments

[doccolt.livejournal.com]

NO Idea how he does that! I mostly skip over maps in a book because my mind doesn't relate them to the written words worth mention. After reading a book several times they sometimes make a little sense.
Sam

Frontispiece?

[johnhawkinson.livejournal.com]

Sometimes a map is like (or just IS) a frontispiece, like a secondary cover of a book. It's something additional or ancillary that may help to draw you in, and might be handy, but is very rarely essential.

For books that are really complicated and long where geography is a critical part of the plot and politics, especially involving battles and campaigns and whether Enemy E can get to Enemy F time Time T at Place P, maps can be important. But they are also traps for authors because they result in fans scrutinizing them and either catching plot inconsistencies or figuring out details unintended for early disclosure — or just being a plain lot of work. I think of Robert Jordan, Patrick Rothfuss, George Martin in this map category.

Sometimes a map is just a pretty add-on. Sometimes it gives you a reference for the story to understand it better.

But rarely does it lend weight; sometimes I think the map is more important for the author (and then, once you have it, why not share it? Well, aside from the abovementioned Reasons Why Not).

And sometimes you appreciate a map for its technical qualities. The map in Game of Thrones was like that. And Tolkien's maps (though I was really disappointed by Shelley Shapiro's redrawing of some of them. For me the original Tolkien maps were part of the story).

And, of course, in space, maps are especially hard, because of the 3D aspects.

[the wol (from livejournal.com)]

I guess I must be a semi-maphead -- I draw floor plans of the houses I write about, and I have drawn a couple of maps of places I write about, one because the story involves a journey that the map traces. But I draw them because they set the stage for me and help me visualize the scenes and give the story a frame of reference. I wouldn't include the floor plans in a published work, but I might include the maps, especially the one about the journey, because the story is about the journey and the journey forms the framework of the story. When it comes to maps in others' works, sometimes I skip over them, sometimes I refer back to them. I think of them more like embellishments, like cover art, or illustrations. But, I feel if you need a map to keep up with the story, the author hasn't done his/her job. Also, the story shouldn't be about the geography, but the people whose lives play out over that geography. I can see an author making maps, because I can see how they would be useful to the author, but the maps should be "transparent" to the reader, embedded in the story in such a way that the reader doesn't need it.

I think whether you, as an author, make maps or not has to do with how your mind works. Not everyone's mind deals with information in the same way. Steve makes maps because that's how his mind organizes and processes information. You don't because your mind handles information in a different way. This may be one of the keys to why the two of you work so well together. Your differences complement (with an 'e') each other.

Why can't I find that?

[bookmobiler.livejournal.com]

Maps can be interesting, and I will peer at them occasionally. Peer is the operative word here as the usual book map size is useless.
The only time I've ever come across useful maps, they were made chapter specific.
In any event I can get lost trying to remember why I came into a room. I can't remember a map long enough for it to be useful.

It depends.....

[sctechsorceress.livejournal.com]

For me, some books are so geographically based that they really NEED a map. Otherwise the 'rode here, drove there, took a ship across the ocean' references can get confusing.

In the Liaden Universe, though, I think any attempt at mapping would only confuse things. The scale is simply too big, too broad for any map that could be put in a book to make any sense at all.

For other books, sometimes a map is what you described. After reading Lord of the Rings a dozen times or more, I knew the relationships between the places so well that the maps became just a handy way of remembering bits of the story.

[joycependle.livejournal.com]

I learned to read maps by driving alone from San Diego CA via El Paso TX to Edmonton Alberta. I was 21 and broke; I had a job waiting for me; I had to get there without taking side trips through the eastern half of the US. What I still can't do is figure how long a trip will take to drive (except on empty freeways - not that they are easy to find). Did Steve learn to love the maps before needing them (ignore question if it is intrusive).

In a book, well, it is nice to know that, say, the Old Forest is roughly east of the Shire and that both are equally far north of Mordor. In Valdemar (SPOILERS), Karse is south of Haven, and that mysterious place with the griffens is way north. I'd be happy to look at a map of Liad, but there are only the one city and perhaps two towns mentioned. I couldn't spend 5 minutes with a street map! And I don't have the lace making skills to read a star map.

[martianmooncrab.livejournal.com]

I recently looked at a map of the Land of Oz so I can see where the winged monkeys came from.

And I loved Islandia..

[drammar.livejournal.com]

I am among those people who turn the map in the direction in which I am traveling. In my brain "north" is always in front of me. Of course I also have a great deal of difficulty telling right from left. Especially on other people -- I generally know which is MY right hand, but yours? I will generally choose your left if not given sufficient time to consider.

What's funny is I love maps -- even when they mean nothing to me. It's always a wonder how everything all fits together. Just don't ask me how to get "there" from "here."

[maurita plouff (from livejournal.com)]

Absolutely, I'm a map fiend. I tend to have spatial awareness; when I started in a new position in corporate land I made little maps of the cubicles so I could learn who was who; when dear hubby asks me where to put something I think first about the movements needed to put it there. Yup - kinesthetic and spatial. Maps are important.

[cailleuch.livejournal.com]

I'm a map person or maybe I'm a 3D spatial person. I don't need a map to understand where things are but I like building it in my mind. I like the fact that I have been given an initial framework by the author.

As in real life I take the flat paper map and build what the world looks like adding in as I go along so that it becomes a 3D construct. ITRW if I go along a road my brain is comparing what it looks like now with the remembered construct. I can give someone directions by mentally walking through the construct.

It is just me and is an outgrowth of the same thing that makes me the sculptor and animator.

[cgbookcat1.livejournal.com]

I love maps and find them aesthetically pleasing. In books that are very dependent on geographical layout and details, I look at them again and again (Tolkien, Elizabeth Moon's Paksenarrion series, etc). These maps add an extra layer of insight into the characters' journey that I can't get without the top-down view. However, I don't need the map to appreciate a story. The characters, plot, and occasionally writing style are enough to drop me into that world. (A character that does not ring true, or extended periods from a viewpoint that I hate, likewise throw me out again.)

Any map of the Liaden universe would have to include multiple planets. I'd love to see one, but I certainly don't need it.

I love maps

[quondame.livejournal.com]

I like maps and am always disappointed if a journey undertaken by the characters in the story involves significant terrain or wormhole jumps which are mappable and are not mapped. But not all narratives require mapping. Ones where the territory covered has consequences on the characters and the plot are enhanced by maps, though maps do sometimes reveal where the author has not been realistic with the landscape or the cultures located on the landscape.
But I have never felt the lack of maps in the Liaden stories. An index of bows, yes, that would be helpful.

[attilathepbnun.livejournal.com]

I love maps --- I get lost very easily, and a map will usually help me figure out how I did that, and thus how I can get back where I want to be!
I seem to have some kind of processing kink -- solely verbal directions can be some what confusing, and a map helps reduce said confusin for me ---- 'So *that*'s where that is!' In books as in real life, this is so for me.
And yes, I am one of those people who turns the map to match the direction I want to go in!

Maps

[electa1906.livejournal.com]

I love maps, but I don't see the need for them in science fiction novels. I like them in fantasy novels where multiple locations and/or journeys are involved. I also have an atlas of Great Britain which I have used to follow along on journeys in historical novels. I don't need that for historical novels taking place in the U.S. since I know where New Orleans is in relation to Philadelphia, but I don't necessarily know where Sheffield is in relation to Bath. I even like floor plans of complex buildings such as a fortress. In college I was fond of cathedral floor plans in an art history class (so OK, that may be a little weird). I am not going to like/dislike a book on the basis of having/not having a map; it is the story and characters that are important. I just enjoy maps. And yes, I do use maps to navigate before I drive in or to an unfamiliar place.

[gjuerne.livejournal.com]

i've always loved maps, i occasionally take a good map to bed for before-sleep studying. I especially love terrain maps with all the elevation lines, i instantly "see" the landscape.

If i'm traveling a complicated city route to an unfamiliar place, i'll turn my map in the direction i'm traveling, but for a long road trip, no need.

I like stories with maps, if i look at it before and during reading the story, it helps me build the visual and keeps me from putting in the wrong directions.

The Liaden Universe doesn't need maps but alas, action in cities has occasionally gotten scrambled in my mind. Mostly i mentally build scenes as i'm reading based on an author's description, but if i've galloped through a book in one sitting i might miss a clue or two. And that is what must have happened when i first encountered Solcintra, i have a landscape firmly imprinted on my mind, and the north/south/east/west orientation in my mind doesn't match the descriptions i encounter upon rereading, i have to laugh at myself that i usually instantly orient myself to the north/south and the latitude/hemisphere of whatever planet one of the characters has landed upon.

i started reading Georgette Heyer a year ago, and it's been really fun to pull out my world atlas and spend evenings mulling over great britain, establishing the geography and rivers in my mind, etc. For me, it enriches the stories.

[lornastutz.livejournal.com]

To me maps are just another tool - useful for when you need to be someplace you've never been at an appointed time. Otherwise, having grown up "in the sticks" my attitude is that one never gets lost - one just finds new places.

[ellenru.livejournal.com]

I'm one of those who always goes over the maps in books, particularly at the beginning until I get a "mind picture" and then I'm good to go. I tend to remember things in a visual manner - telling someone "I saw your answer on the page about half way down ....here". But once I have the picture in my head it can be difficult to dislodge. The concession (country) roads around where I live used to mostly be called by Concession No. with occasional names. Now everything has a name - but the picture in my head is still names and numbers and I have to look at one of the "new" maps with the new names to get what they're referring to.

I mostly don't have to spin the map around while driving, but if I haven't internalized where I'm going, I will.

[trolleypup.livejournal.com]

Mapfreak. Always have been.

In books, I will refer back to maps, but they aren't a critical part...if they are a necessity, the author probably isn't doing a good job.

I love topographic maps...for armchair exploring, travel/hiking, and post-travel examination. In difficult terrain or when I am trying to identify (distant) landmarks, I will sometimes turn a map for orientation.

[manywaters.livejournal.com]

I like maps, but generally only refer to them while reading or after a first read, in order to help me keep things straight, or provide more context.

I would love a map of Liad, so that I might better understand the spatial relationship between Chonselta to Solcintra in the context of both the ferry and the transport work around Liad. For me, the line that separates when one needs to fly, call a car, or ride a ferry is a bit murky. Chonselta proper to Chonselta Port, to understand the city that Aelliana walked through in her thoughts, that's another one that a map would help me with.

I Love Maps, As Well

[libertariansold.livejournal.com]

World maps only, though not star maps.
Of course, having spent 30 years using them to navigate (I was a pre-GPS soldier) I kinda got used to using them.

[amm-me.livejournal.com]

I love maps, and almost always know (and NEED to know) where the compass directions are around me. On the other hand, at the scale possible in a book where a single page is allotted to the map, I find them less than useful. And many times, even though a map is offered, geography doesn't seem to play enough part in the story to have required it. Also, if you are going to give geographical info in the text, with or without a map, you need to be particularly careful to proofread all instance of left, right, east, west, etc. I will be thrown right out of the story if a directional word goes counter to the worldmap I have imagined.

I feel no need for a map of Liad. However, a map of the port road on Surebleak would be kinda nice. Particularly since the descent of Korval upon the world, I have been somewhat puzzled by the geographical relationship of Melina Sherton, Jelaza Kazone, Yulie Shaper, the rest of the city, etc.

The maps I love are the fairly large-scale maps of places like southern England, where by poring over the tiniest place-names you discover, for instance, Tolpuddle, Puddletown, Piddletrenthide, and Piddlehinton. Maps that only show the main places, with great blanks in between, are not near as much fun.

[kinzel.livejournal.com]

Maps have a been a joy to me from ... i dunno, from around the time I learned to read, I guess. I inherited a bunch of maps along with several huge swaths of National Geographic magazines when I was young and I got my own subscription to National Geographic sometime when I was in elementary school -- and of course, National Geographic came with lots of maps! Did I *need them* when I was 11? Well, no, I guess, but I really did like them.

Nice. Rarely Required

[charlie russel (from livejournal.com)]

I find maps rarely add much to what I read. And now that I read almost exclusively on an eReader, maps are essentially useless anyway. They really don't work all that well on a standard Kindle (or Nook or Kobo.) And they're certainly not required for me to get immersed in a world and believe it. OTOH, if there is a very specific street-level map that can make something clearer, then I want the map.

[kay-gmd.livejournal.com]

In my experience maps help me follow complicated books where the location is key. I haven't felt the lack in the Liaden universe. I do find being able to hear the characters, and I look forward to picking up some of the audio books for that.

It would add fun and expand understanding to see the layout of a key location like Bechimo, or Jelaza Calzone (I apologize for spelling errors I'm pulling these off the top of my head).

Maps

[catherine ives (from livejournal.com)]

I like practical maps of places in this world, like UT. As for all the other places like Westeros, etc. they are ok. I don't really care about them that much. I always think well, what if someone left something out? or, how do you know that's a good map? that's just your opinion etc. Surebleak seems so little settled that it must be pretty easy. At one end of the road is the Port and at the other the big house and the tree with the neighboring cat sanctuary.