Clarifying Sub-genres

[rolanni]

This is a continuation and expansion of a discussion started over on Facebook, which was kickstarted by this summary of Carousel Sun:

Urban fantasy novel, sequel to Carousel Tides (2010), about a woman who returns to a small town in Maine and becomes involved in a faerie war. (Locus Monitor -- New Books, 4 February)

There are a couple of things wrong with the above.  Most notably, Carousel Sun isn't Urban Fantasy, because it takes place in Maine, and it does not take place in Bangor, Lewiston-Auburn, or Portland, which are the three "urban" areas in the whole state, according to the Federal Government.

I'm also wondering where they got this "faerie war."

We thought we'd be OK by calling the Carousel books "contemporary fantasy," but apparently "contemporary fantasy" means something Very Definite to some people.  (To me, "contemporary fantasy" means "a fantasy story that takes place Right Now.")

So, I've been giving some thought to how best to describe these books, as much in order to guide readers who would like this kind, as warn away those readers who come in thinking they're getting A Specific Thing that the books don't deliver.  (Like, oh, "faerie wars.")

Now, the best I can come up with as a sub-genre is "mundane fantasy." Kate, after all, doesn't get a free pass on anything for being Guardian -- it's Added Responsibility for which she goes uncompensated (cue Superman's Song). Fercryinoutloud, Gaby collects returnables, and I don't see Borgan flyin' no yacht. Felsic's crew -- wait, do you guys have Felsic yet? Anyhow, it's not like any of these folks are living high in the fancy condos; they're working people, doing their jobs.

So, like I said: "mundane fantasy" or maybe "blue collar" fantasy, though there has been some concern expressed that, while these come close, they don't quite Nail It.

Summing up, the points for discussion are:

1.  What are your expectations of "contemporary fantasy"

2.  If you had to tighten the classification for the Carousel books (Tides and Sun), what phrase would you use?  Please try to avoid spoilers for the books.

Have at it!

Comments

[pgranzeau.livejournal.com]

I would have figured out "urban fantasy," myself. Evidently, that's the term for a number of contemporary fantasies, such as War for the Oaks (which is urban, of course). "Contemporary fantasy" is a less familiar term, but more inclusive if you don't consider Archer's Beach to be at all "urban". You seem to have modeled some of Archer's Beach on Old Orchard Beach, which I consider to be a small city--it's larger than my home town, Burlington, WI, which I did consider to be a (quite) small city, but definitely urban in character.

Nor did the use of "faerie" throw me off. Kate is involved in stuff that just ain't real, after all. I can stretch the term to include what happens to Kate Archer quite easily, and the blurb wouldn't have misled my expectations of the novel at all.

But "contemporary fantasy?" I don't know. I agree that's pretty well inclusive, but I would rather that term than "mundane fantasy", which seems to be one of those oxymorons people keep bringing up, kind of like "military intelligence." Either it's mundane, or it's fantasy, right?

[jhetley.livejournal.com]

"Mundane fantasy" is trying to break my brain.

[attilathepbnun.livejournal.com]

*offers chocolate for brain repair*

[kalimeg.livejournal.com]

A present-day fantasy, where a Guardian of our dimension meets with challenges from both our world and others.

[jhetley.livejournal.com]

Oh, dear. I've been using "contemporary fantasy" without care, and it has a definition? A definition that does not apply to us?

Yeah, I can't see "urban fantasy" for my stories, either.

Is "small-town fantasy" taken?

[attilathepbnun.livejournal.com]

'Modern fantasy', perhaps?

[pedanther]

Speaking for myself, my definition of "contemporary fantasy" is close to yours, and I like it just fine as a description of the Carousel books. Which probably means I'm not the person to give you useful answers.

(I sometimes think etymology is not a friend when it comes to understanding marketing categories; to say a book is "contemporary fantasy" is to say that it significantly resembles other books that have been said to be contemporary fantasy, regardless of the actual meanings of the words. Mike Ford's The Last Hot Time has "A Contemporary Fantasy" printed on the front cover. "Fantasy" is undeniable, what with the elves and things; "urban fantasy" would be understandable, given that it's set in Chicago. "Contemporary fantasy", now... it's set an unspecified but not insignificant number of years in the future, with a backstory that, allowing for it being elves and not space aliens, would be familiar to many a science fiction fan. But elves it is, and there's something about the whole thing that would be comfortingly familiar to a reader of contemporary fantasy, so "A Contemporary Fantasy" it is.)

[charlie russel (from livejournal.com)]

Contemporary fantasy seemed as close as anything. "Maine Fantasy" doesn't quite have the ring to it. I kind of like "blue collar fantasy", but it doesn't really mean anything, and besides, it makes me want to put it in an auto plant. (Born and raised in Detroit, blue collar is auto plants, pure and simple.) It's not geek fantasy, since even though we have a former software engineer, that's peripheral to what she is and does in these books, mostly.

[readinggeek451]

I would say 'contemporary fantasy' when describing it to others. 'Mundane fantasy', as others have said above, breaks my brain a little, and is emphatically not an appealing description to me. (I would actually call it 'urban fantasy' in the privacy of my own mind, because my idiosyncratic definition of that term doesn't mean 'fantasy in cities' but rather 'faerie intruding into the real world in a contemporary setting'. I imprinted a little too hard on certain aspects of War for the Oaks when forming my personal definition of the term. My brain is weird.)

[attilathepbnun.livejournal.com]

*offers brain-repair chocolate*

[readinggeek451]

Mmmmm, chocolate!

fantasy

[nocal-kathyf.livejournal.com]

Hi, I guess I'd rather just have fantasy and science fiction and leave it to the reader to decide what they like. Ah well. Contemporary fantasy would be my choice from those given. I agree that mundane fantasy doesn't work for me at all. I guess Baen needs guidance in getting the book to the largest audience, (all hail the publishers!) but getting too specific might turn off readers who would otherwise browse and then buy the books.

[kk1raven.livejournal.com]

Plain old "fantasy" works fine for me for the Carousel books as does "contemporary fantasy". My preference is to stop dividing genres up so narrowly. I think that doing so tends to encourage limitations on what is available, encouraging more books that publishers can put the narrow labels on and less books that don't fit the labels.

Your definition of "contemporary fantasy" sounds fine to me. I expect it to mean that the story takes place in a world that is mostly like our own, at what seems to be the present time, has at least some characters who are like us, and that it has some fantasy elements added to the realistic setting and characters.

[mizkit.livejournal.com]

Urban fantasy and contemporary fantasy are essentially synonymous to my mind, although there are a fair number of small town urban fantasies. I don't know what a contemporary fantasy is that has such a definite, different definition in some people's minds...? Anyway, despite the inarguable inexactitude, I'd still no doubt call it urban fantasy, just like the Stackhouse books are urban fantasy despite taking place in small-town Louisiana.

[muirecan.livejournal.com]

I would have called it contemporary fantasy. You mean contemporary fantasy means something other than this book? I'm confused now. I suppose Urban Fantasy would work because despite urban implying urban locations it also has a modern feel.

Mundane Fantasy makes by brain hurt.

[attilathepbnun.livejournal.com]

*hands over more brain-repair chocolate*

[martianmooncrab.livejournal.com]

now, if your book had a totally different cover, pubbed by a bigger (or smaller house), and marketed as Lit'Tra'Ture, it would be considered Magic Realism. But never something so ...marginalized as Modern Fantasy.

[jhetley.livejournal.com]

I had thought of that, but I think "magical realism" has to be written in Spanish.

[martianmooncrab.livejournal.com]

or French?

I wonder if CarouselPunk would be a category?

[antti-juhani kaijanaho (from livejournal.com)]

Magical realism is quite a popular genre in Finnish, too. For me, it signifies boring books :-P

[attilathepbnun.livejournal.com]

'Modern fantasy' is marginalized?
More than fantasy in general?

[martianmooncrab.livejournal.com]

I think it depends on the amount of sneer involved...

[catlinye-maker.livejournal.com]

If I was describing the Carousel series to a friend I'd say "urban fantasy set in a small beach town in Maine" because "urban fantasy" to me means "faerie interacting with modern-day setting". But I don't think that works for folks that aren't wired like me. So. Contemporary Faerie? Alliterative but not much more. Quotidian Fantasy? -any excuse to use quotidian. :) If Contemporary Fantasy doesn't work because it describes a subset of which this book is not in, how about Present-day Fantasy?

I have no helpful suggestions, alas. Also, for me like most other folks, "mundane fantasy" is an oxymoron (Elrond prepping for an IRS audit?) and would turn me off a book which was labeled such.

[readinggeek451]

"urban fantasy" to me means "faerie interacting with modern-day setting"

So I'm not the only one!

[deor.livejournal.com]

Me too!

[ejmam.livejournal.com]

That's what it means to me too. The name is an artifact of the first use of the label, which did take place in cities, I think. But the important part of the sub-genre is that the fantasy is interacting with modern-day stuff, not the city streets.

At least that's how I use it.

[djonn]

It would be helpful to know what this unhelpfully narrow perception of "contemporary fantasy" actually is; without that context, it's hard to know what the taxonomic issues really are. My own usage tends to treat "contemporary fantasy" as a relatively broad class, encompassing "urban fantasy" or "urban faerie" as well as a variety of other things.

Absent more detail, two thoughts. You might see whether your "contemporary fantasy" zealots have the same issues with "modern fantasy" (or possibly "modern faerie"). Alternately, I am beginning to think that the phrase "paranormal fantasy" may have some value, as a means of identifying books which are clearly not romances but which share the general tool-set of today's "paranormal romance".

Oh: "mundane fantasy" is a nonstarter. That phrase makes my brain hurt.

[attilathepbnun.livejournal.com]

*digs out more chocolate*

[grassrose.livejournal.com]

I'm just here for the chocolate. :-)

Seriously, while "urban" is still a bit jarring in this context, I agree with those whose interpretation of it has loosened. I interpret it as fantasy set in a world and a time that could be my own. However, I have no problem with calling it "contemporary fantasy", either. Just so long as I get my fix, you can call it whatever you want.

Although "mundane fantasy" makes my head hurt *hands over face, peering hopefully between fingers*

[gareth griffiths (from livejournal.com)]

The chocolate sounds good. - maybe Chocolate fantasy - no-one would know what it is and it sounds nice...

"Coastal fantasy" - rather than Urban fantasy. I think we can rule out "Urbane fantasy".

Mainely Fantasy. Small-town fantasy caputures it quite well. I can't see why modern fantasy or contemporary fantasy don't work. Maybe just advertise as "Genre crossing fantasy" and let people make their own minds up. I hate pigeon holing books.

mundane fantasy

[88cubes.livejournal.com]

How about humble fantasy or homespun fantasy?

Love the books, by the way!

[timepiece]

I'm kind of astonished that the word "Paranormal" seems lacking in this discussion. Oh, wait, I see one person did bring it up. Anyway, I would totally go with "paranormal fiction" and/or "urban fantasy". Despite the non-urban setting. In this context (meaning modern publishing and marketing), urban fantasy = "fantasy not in a pseudo-medieval universe", not urban.

I suggest a two by four!

[bookmobiler.livejournal.com]

It could be applied up side the head of people who get to nit-picky.
Just plain fantasy works for me.
If you insist on an adjective enjoyable also works.